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The big transition can proceed

camembert electrique

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camembert electrique @ 2022-04-20 20:57:59 UTC

What I'm really worried about now is that the situation is incredibly error prone. I expect dozens of releases will each month be attributed to Columbia instead of Columbia [EMI] . And I have no idea how to prevent this.

I think we've already had that question before. Now, that we have Columbia [EMI], we need Columbia [CBS] (or even [CBS/Sony]) as a counterpart.

dany

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dany @ 2022-04-21 08:15:04 UTC

Being somewhat more exhaustive... from the historical point of view (which here is the essential point of view) there are two great milestones in the Columbia label:

1. The foundation of the label in 1888

2. The events of 1931 that provoked a kind of schism in the Columbia label

These two milestones give rise to two major periods:


1 - From 1888 until 1931 (Columbia pre 1931)

We have here a single entity that acts worldwide (duration: 43 years)

( these releases are now in Columbia )


2 - From 1931 onwards (Columbia post 1931)


2.1 - Columbia label whose owner is a company based in the USA

Territory (market): USA, Canada and Mexico ---> Columbia (not all) + Columbia [MX] (not all) (1931-1987)

2.1.1 - Period pre-CBS

2.1.2 - Period CBS (1938-1987)

2.2 - Columbia label whose owner is a company based in Japan

Territory (market): Japan ---> Nippon Columbia (from 1931)

2.3 - Columbia label whose owner is a company based in Spain

Territory (market): Spain ---> Columbia [ES] (1935 to 1984)

2.4 - Columbia label whose owner is a company based in UK

Territory (market): The rest of the world ---> Columbia [EMI] (1931 to 1990)


I have left out of the scheme the role of SONY as buyer and great reunifier of the Columbia label.

Last edit: 2022-04-21 09:35:30 UTC by dany

camembert electrique

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camembert electrique @ 2022-04-21 14:38:00 UTC

Yes, my above answer was possibly a bit too short.

Of course, things are even more complicated than dany's very good listing.

Just one quick remark for 2.3: In Spain, Columbia was a trademark of BMG (likely from 1984) until 2004, when Sony via the BMG merger managed to get the rights.

dany

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dany @ 2022-04-21 15:52:45 UTC

Just one quick remark for 2.3: In Spain, Columbia was a trademark of BMG (likely from 1984) until 2004, when Sony via the BMG merger managed to get the rights.


Yes.

When, in 1984, Discos Columbia S.A. was bought by BMG, this company closed the label... and that was the end of the history of the Spanish Columbia.

https://rateyourmusic.com/label/discos_columbia/

dany

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dany @ 2022-04-22 07:22:37 UTC

As this very important issue does not correspond exactly to this thread, I transfer it here:

https://secondhandsongs.com/topic/77265

I take this opportunity to remember that we are still waiting to finish the transfer of EPs from Columbia to Columbia [EMI]

Last edit: 2022-04-22 07:34:05 UTC by dany


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Bastien

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Bastien @ 2022-04-28 08:36:42 UTC

What I'm really worried about now is that the situation is incredibly error prone. I expect dozens of releases will each month be attributed to Columbia instead of Columbia [EMI] . And I have no idea how to prevent this.

NOW, that we have Columbia [EMI], we need Columbia [CBS] (or even [CBS/Sony]) as a counterpart.

Looks like a useful and idea and something we need to handle urgently, otherwise newly created entries will continue to be added to Columbia .

So what do we do? Rename Columbia ? Or create a new Columbia [CBS] ?

Last edit: 2022-04-28 08:48:53 UTC by Bastien

dany

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dany @ 2022-04-28 13:13:20 UTC

Why is this distinction of any importance for us? This is a wonderful question !!!!!

Imagine that you must classify a Columbia issue that was released in the USA in 1924 or 1935...

Would you classify it, for example, on a label called Columbia [CBS] or Columbia [Sony] ?

Probably, your answer would be: no, because at that time, the company that owned it was neither CBS nor Sony...

That label (established in New York, NY, United States) changed hands several times, eventually becoming the property of CBS and, later, of Sony.

Bastien

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Bastien @ 2022-06-02 09:10:54 UTC

dany and do we have to make separate label pages for 2.1.1 and 2.1.2 ?

dany

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dany @ 2022-06-06 13:49:08 UTC

Bastien ... it is very easy: nothing has to be done.

We are facing the same label (Columbia label, based in New York) that changes ownership:

Owner A ---> Owner B ----> 1938: owner C (Columbia Broadcasting System-CBS-----> 1988: owner D: Sony company


It's similar to what we saw with the Medley label.

https://secondhandsongs.com/topic/77194

Bastien

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Bastien @ 2022-06-23 15:11:34 UTC

So how do we call Columbia 2.1 ? Columbia [USMC 1937-1981] ?

And should I rename an existing label? Or create one from scratch?

dany

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dany @ 2022-06-23 16:56:45 UTC

Bastien

I have meditated a lot on that question and I have come up with the following idea:

Once the Columbia [EMI] is separated, we are left with a Columbia label, based in New York, which could remain as a single entity, and whose current owner is Sony.

In practice, we are talking about an American label created in 1888 and that, after suffering a kind of schism, is still active today.

What is your opinion?

Bastien

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Posts: 31985

Bastien @ 2022-06-23 18:04:00 UTC

Basically this Columbia label would be everything minus Columbia 2.2, Columbia 2.3 and Columbia 2.4?

camembert electrique

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camembert electrique @ 2022-06-23 19:35:57 UTC

Now also having meditated a bit, I think dany is suggesting a feasable solution. It is factually OK and avoids further complicating. So I'll skip my long-time idea of Columbia [CBS] for the period in question.

And yes: minus Columbia 2.2, Columbia 2.3 and Columbia 2.4.

As we have Columbia [EMI] for the rest of the world, this actually applies to Northern America.

dany

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dany @ 2022-06-23 21:33:18 UTC

Dear comrades,

it seems that we are seeing the end of a long, very long, controversy...

waiting for the idea to be discussed, of course...

I want to propose a toast (brindis, in spanish) on this night of San Juan...

Long live the Columbia label and all its derivatives !! Smile

Last edit: 2022-06-23 21:47:28 UTC by dany

dany

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dany @ 2022-06-27 09:59:32 UTC

sebcat

https://rateyourmusic.com/label/columbia_records/

New York is the original home of the Columbia label... and remains the current headquarters.

550 Madison Avenue

New York, NY, United States

10022

http://www.columbiarecords.com/

Copyright © 2022 Sony Music Entertainment. All Rights Reserved.

COLUMBIA and the "Walking Eye" Design are registered trademarks of Sony Music Entertainment.

Owning company right now: Sony Music Entertainment